What if...

[JulieB]

I am sure this has been answered somewhere on this forum, but here it is again: What if a prospect is skittish about committing himself to taking out an ad simply because there is no guarantee that the card will actually be filled? I can totally see this question coming. Then what?

In fact, this leads me to the problem I am having with a lot of these hypothetical ways of making money which is that the mechanics of it all are usually not talked about .(I know it's not hypothetical to quite a few of you because you are filling those cards, it's just that nobody seems to share the unsexy backstore parts of hammering out agreements in writing and so forth.)

For instance, let's say some pizza guy takes out an ad. You ask him for half payment beforehand, half at completion of card, yes? You are putting that in writing I hope? What are the stipulations? What if he changes his mind? What if you never get enough ads together to even break even, let along make a profit?

What if you can't agree on the graphics, or the offer?

Do you guys use contracts, and if so, where do you get them? Is someone on here providing people with sample contracts that can be customized?

Thanks for reading.

Just wondering and scratching my head.... balding rapidly:rolleyes:....

[Vikuna]

Secoff had a package but I think Bob took it over, here's an old link; http://bobrossoffline.com/forum/showthread.php?305-BackOffice-Bundle-Forms-Scripts-Contracts-amp-More!&highlight=contracts

HTH, Eva

[Altad solutions]

I am an over-thinker like yourself..
- I thought what if I can't fill the card!? Not to mention you don't have to - just try to break even on your first card!
- What if I sell some spots but still don't break even? Funny thing is if I made a WSO that "guaranteed" filling a card many people will gladly buy it... BUT if they have to invest in their own card to get it out its a "NO-NO" that's a loss...
- What if.. What if.. What if..

so to more directly answer your question or questions rather... what I do is I write on the invoice terms "Deposit is only partially refundable. In any event of cancellation artwork is to be completed & delivered according to terms".. I don't do contracts, when I ask for design details, logos Ect.. I simply state the terms are "you get two designs with 2 revisions each any additional changes will be charged accordingly"...

[Mister Natural]

the easy and less aggravating solution:

Move on to other people. Get your card out.
Then return to the difficult guy with your own "PUBLISHED" card, along with some NEW REFERENCES.

Ask Mr. Difficult one more time if he would like to help his own business. If he hesitates again or, conjures up some reason.. move on. You're running your own business and "you can't fix stupid".

Don't allow him to waste your time.

[JulieB]

Thanks for the link, Eva, I just bought the package.

Mr. Natural, you are a natural at this, what can I say... And, you are right - you can't fix stupid. It's good to remember that. Thanks!

Altad, so please allow me to ask, has anybody ever balked at this phrase, "Deposit is only partially refundable?" Is this even fair? Except, you could say they got some new graphics in return, so their investment wasn't a total loss, but still.... It's a little thin.

I don't actually believe I'm overthinking this. If you take out an ad in a newspaper and it folds before your ad gets to appear, don't you think you would be upset and would want your money back?

Just sayin...

[Altad solutions]

I'm not as successful as many of these guys with only a few M4's out but no I never had anyone reject payment, I had one person ask me about more details and I simply said "We will start working on design as soon as we receive the deposit so in the case you decide to cancel we will refund the deposit minus a $50 Design fee..." his reply was "fair enough"

[JulieB]

Okay, this I understand. Thanks for clearing this up Altad.

[swilliams09]

I tell you what I keep running into. "Talk to us after your first one". It's the gosh darn motto around these parts. I've only got 3 sold and I'm like 2 weeks out from my print date. I'm going all in for the next two weeks. Rock bottom prices, doubling my calls and emails asking for referrals aggressively, hiring appointment sitters. I'm also securing funds to put the card out no matter what. I know if I can get the first one just out there, I can get more.

[Mister Natural]

Focus on businesses offering high priced products and, or, services.
All of which target homeowners and automobiles.
Why? Because just one customer would easily cover the cost of your ad whatever that cost might be. And that will mean easier sales conversions for you. A guy who sells 15 thousand dollar roof replacements isn't going to choke over the price of your advertising.

Forget about all those cute little yogurt, coffee, sandwich, and cookie shops.
They would have to recoup 100 new sales to cover the cost of your ad. They know their numbers. They know their average receipt is like $3.95 so, when you say ... the ad is ONLY $495.00.. their stomach does a flip and a voice in their head is screaming ABORT! RETREAT!

Go through the Newspapers and Yellow Pages and find contractors like electricians, plumbers, HVAC , and 100 other niches then, automobile type businesses. Small car lots, the buy here pay here type, mechanics, transmissions, tires.

Stress the fact that you found their ad in Section E page 9 of the newspaper or, page 579 of the Yellow Pages surrounded by their direct competition. Ask them "how much page 579 cost per year". Refresh their memory and they'll be thinking,,, "it costs too d*mn much"

School is almost out.
A lot of people are going to need daycare for their kids. A decent daycare will charge $100 or more a week per child. Again, one new customer easily covers the cost of your ad.

Then look for doctors advertising via direct mail now or in newspapers. One new customer can generate $1000's for these guys. Then consider attorneys and local Bail Bondsmen.
They make big money from knuckleheads needing to "bail out of jail". And attorneys "drink" three hundred dollars a week.

All of the above business types should have no problem handing you $300 to $400 to blast their message into 10,000 TARGETED addresses. With the powerful IMPACT of a front page listing and, without any competition.

Not sure what the economy is down there but I'm guessing it's nothing like Manhattan, L.A. or San Francisco.

Don't be afraid to downgrade your card's size or the paper weight.
100lb cover with gloss coating is a very slight difference to the touch and will save you hundreds of dollars. The public won't notice the paper weight, if anything, they'll look at your card and say, "well... this is different".

16pt Gloss card stock will impress only those in the business. I get ads every week from multi billion dollar companies printed on what appears to be newsprint. They don't care about impressing people, they don't waste their own money on the heaviest card stock available. Don't agonize over the paper, use it to save yourself hundreds of dollars.

You have 3 sold now so, there is "possibly" a completed M3 right now.

Go to local charities, food bank, homeless shelters, women's shelters, and offer them a free ad on the condition they refer you to their many sponsors via a mass email... putting in a kind word and, introducing you to a large percentage of businesses in town.

Good Luck

[rugman]

Great advice - the basement waterpoofing company that I got (read about it in my M3-M6 post) has an average job ticket of 7K. They are very busy - still fixing stuff from Super Storm Sandy but they still advertise everywhere! I haven't finished up with the driveway sealer guy but I bet his average job ticket is pretty high as well. The handyman charges $400 a day - my average shower re-grout is 4-600 and I just finished a $1400 floor clean/grout re-color.

[Mister Natural]

Great advice - the basement waterpoofing company that I got (read about it in my M3-M6 post) has an average job ticket of 7K. They are very busy - still fixing stuff from Super Storm Sandy but they still advertise everywhere! I haven't finished up with the driveway sealer guy but I bet his average job ticket is pretty high as well. The handyman charges $400 a day - my average shower re-grout is 4-600 and I just finished a $1400 floor clean/grout re-color.


Exactly !

That's why an ad price of $400 offered to these guys,,,, for more customers,,, is almost a 99% NO BRAINER !

Regarding using the heavier card stock:
Somewhere out there,,there is an old lady with a pair of scissors cussing while she says:
"I really want this coupon!!! Why do they insist upon using this thick cardboard?
I like that thin paper stuff, it's perfect for cutting with scissors ! "

perhaps this is why they use the thin stuff,, to make it easy for people to redeem ?